KittyCatS Love & Frustration

[Emilia Darkwatch]

As a comment about "the games", he says it all the time to people... he says it in this context "I have no time for games" (he said this to me also when I had actually said NOTHING whatsoever to him and he was irritated by my silence... quite ridiculous)... it is not so much the games which are important. It is the NO TIME part... he has simply no tolerance or humanity and will not wait because everything has to happen immediately. He demands to know THEN... NOW and RIGHT away. This is how ridiculous and control freakish this individual's world IS

In the same vein, he says to Eleanor he needs to log off... it is to push and force and bully the person to decide immediately. Threats are bad enough but a threat with a time frame is even more vicious and pressuring. It is a common theme he does most every single time and is far from clever. Bullying tactics are really very immature and unevolved coping strategies

And in exactly the same manner... he would not and could not wait for me to update profilers even though I was dealing with a death in my family. It is all his way... then and there... it truly is the reverse of emotional intelligence. I don't care what is wrong with him to cause it, this behaviour and treatment of people is just disgusting

[Kikii Littlepaws]

I'm sad to say that I bought both the Group and Owner versions of Rene's profiler. I thought that it was a helpful product for getting the word out about my cats and my auctions. I thought it was nice to be able to browse cats with filters on his market page. I thought it would help to have my auctions listed on the calendar, there. So, I forked out for both the individual and the group versions. Individual for myself, at first, but then group for auctions. In the beginning, I even found Rene to be kind and helpful.

But then, perfectly lovely friends and patrons began having issues. I recall one who couldn't list her cat, nor could I, on the group profilers that I set up in my auction area. It didn't matter which of us input her cat, it seemed, hers would just not show up in the auction info or on the market site at all. I'm not even sure why that was, at that time, because this was *before* the existence of the so-called competitor's product.

I perve pedigrees old school, too, but I do it hand-in-hand with usage of a profiler. Sometimes, depending on the owners of the cat's ancestors, you can actually see more on the profiler than you can perving the pedigree old school, particularly when proxy situations happen. So, both as an auctioneer and a breeder/seller of cats, I enjoy having one.

That said, Torgon's is more affordable. Torgon's does the job of showing ancestry up to great-grandparents. Torgon's provides auction and market listings, and it does things that Monsieur Marseille's will NOT do. Customization is lovely for those that want it.

However, bottom line for me is this: While I recognize that Rene Marseille is not responsible for returning any L$ spent on his products, which did work at the time of purchase, I find his behavior very unethical. I don't appreciate bullies, and he *is* a bully.

With that, I'll just point at my signature. I'm not a friend of Torgon's. I don't know Torgon really at all, though I have found him to be kind when I have needed assistance. And I am happy to have given him my L$ for the profilers, even if that means I'm banned from using the ones I forked out L$5500 in total for. I'd leave a review on the marketplace for them, but I bought them in world. I might try the comment piggy-backing thing, but that feels a little rude to whomever may have left a nice & genuinely grateful review. I have nothing to gain with the image in my signature, or the link to his marketplace listing - but I believe in the product, and more than that, I believe that this is one way to do just what the little graphic says; Support Honest & Fair Creators.

I would ban Rene at CatTales, to be honest, and I think Mirsoul would agree with me, but I don't want to cause a problem for our renters who still use his products, since he requires that he be permitted to access them wherever they are in use. If I could afford to buy each of our renters one of Torgon's, though, I'd do it in a heartbeat. Rene isn't trying to defend his IP, he knows that he has no legal leg to stand on, he's just trying to bully everyone into allowing him a monopoly on a product/service, that frankly, someone else did a lot more affordably!

[Emilia Darkwatch]

I'm sorry to hear of your experiences, Kiki. You wrote this... "I recall one who couldn't list her cat, nor could I, on the group profilers that I set up in my auction area. It didn't matter which of us input her cat, it seemed, hers would just not show up in the auction info or on the market site at all. I'm not even sure why that was, at that time, because this was *before* the existence of the so-called competitor's product. " I would suggest the reason might be because he was banning people even before Torgon's profiler was invented for reasons such as them not wishing to put the price (which should have been fine... it was an OPTION then, except of course it was not really because he wanted it done his way which WAS to put the price). There were phases of banning well before Torgon's involving people being dictated to to put the price or get banned. He tried to enforce it then but because of pressure from the community and Callie, he backed off... saying eventually "no you don't have to put the price". Those threads are here on the forums still. Of course as true to form... he did not keep his word and ended up forcing it and that people MUST put the price. They had no choice, some of us said "no" and those ones saying no got banned at these earlier times. It is yet more of the same pattern of intolerance where he cannot respect the choice of the individual and simply does not comprehend what the hell customers and customer service are. He has no clue, as proved time and time again. There were also other "reasons", which were not regarding price of the cat being shown, most absolutely ridiculous, such as in the case of Arwen

It is, in large part due to this earlier behaviour... that the very need for a second profiler was created. It was created because RM created the need for it by bullying people. Yet he simply does not get this very evident fact, even though it is clear as day to everyone else

It is notable that in addition to those who now use Torgon's due to poor treatment and/or bans by RM, there are also those who actually just wish to use both types of profiler just because they do. For example because they feel they may be able to sell cats better if they advertise on both markets. This choice is NOT yours to make according to RM and is even a violation of his TOS. Absolute dictatorial nonsense and does not respect YOUR right to sell YOUR cats as YOU want. Don't be in any doubt please, read his updated TOS on his website as it says clear as day if you use anything but his, he claims every right to ban you. It's not fair and it is not reasonable, especially as you never signed anything to say you agree to those terms... but he does not care about anything you want, which is why he does it over and over and over

Also very important is the fact before we were being bullied, he was doing it to KittyCatS themselves. They never told him he had permission to use their images but true to form, instead of having the simple courtesy to wait for their response, he bullied ahead and made the profiler, not caring that they had copyright on images and a name he used. This is total disrespect and not even understanding the bare bones of business. You CANNOT use the copywritten name of a company nor their copywritten images... but he can (apparently) because he owns everything, right? In his deluded world, sure. It all belongs to him to use as he wishes. And then, he ended up eventually whining that Callie is oh so mean to not let him use her images... that is NOT mean, she owns them! It is her copyright! He did not give KittyCatS the simple courtesy to have time to decide what they wanted to do with their own own content, and was hardly ever going to get it by trying to bully them. Sound familiar? I think it probably will, as it is really not so different from what he tries to do when he comes to OUR stores and FORCE and BULLY his will. He has no boundaries, I doubt he ever will. He is incapable of understanding the basic premise of "THIS belongs to me... THAT belongs to you" which is essential to healthy boundaries

It is beyond me absolutely, how this fool can whinge about people taking his ideas when they have done nothing of the sort. HE HAS though. He took the KittyCatS name itself and didn't just slap it on the profiler name, no no... he even put it as his main website name. He took their images which he did not have permission to take, in order to make his product saleable (most of us fell for it as it had cute pics of cats on them, and that was a big selling point). Without those 2 things... the name and the images I doubt he would have gotten very far. He did NOT have permission ever to take either. In addition, he doesn't own the word "profiler" nor the concept. Web markets were not his concept either... they existed before him. Yet he acts as if he invented it all. He does not, he never did. HE copies those who did it before HIM and took THEIR ideas. The only difference is, as far as I am aware, those predecessors don't behave like him over it

Torgon is a professional. His customer service is excellent, he does not get into petty disputes with RM or about him, and overall he seems a very happy and nice guy... which RM most certainly is not. Furthermore, he does not bully, he does not dictate, he does not insult the competition to make himself look bigger or better and he does not go from store to store like some envious, maladjusted person picking fights because God forbid, you decided what YOU can put in your store! RM will pick a fight based on your none-exclusive profiler choice through to the fact he doesn't approve of your political beliefs. Torgon listens to his customers and is able to understand the dynamic RM just cannot. Why anyone is paying 3 times the price to RM to get bullied and verbally abused, is absolutely beyond me. I cannot say it loud enough... if you are reading this and considering buying a profiler, please for the love of God or whatever you wish, do yourself a favour and BUY TORGON'S PROFILER

[Kikii Littlepaws]

(01-26-2018 01:15 AM)Emilia Darkwatch Wrote:  Torgon is a professional. His customer service is excellent, he does not get into petty disputes with RM or about him, and overall he seems a very happy and nice guy... which RM most certainly is not. Furthermore, he does not bully, he does not dictate, he does not insult the competition to make himself look bigger or better and he does not go from store to store like some envious, maladjusted person picking fights because God forbid, you decided what YOU can put in your store! RM will pick a fight based on your none-exclusive profiler choice through to the fact he doesn't approve of your political beliefs. Torgon listens to his customers and is able to understand the dynamic RM just cannot. Why anyone is paying 3 times the price to RM to get bullied and verbally abused, is absolutely beyond me. I cannot say it loud enough... if you are reading this and considering buying a profiler, please for the love of God or whatever you wish, do yourself a favour and BUY TORGON'S PROFILER

All of this, so much this, and hence my signature image. Because I've been asked, I'll just add that anyone else who would like to use that image is more than welcome. The url to the image is http://i64.tinypic.com/k1axc1.png

[Devilness Chant]

Hi all! I used to breed and sell, soooo I still troll forums, mostly to see the new traits and pictures in showroom.
Anyway. I remember all the controversy about Rene. I understood he couldn't use the kc pictures on his web site as it's a copyright thing. My question is, how come he can still use the same pictures on his profilers?
If I were a new person to breeding and selling, I would want the one that has the prettiest pictures, thinking it would make my kitties more desirable.
Maybe it would be a good idea to enforce the copyright law on the profilers themselves to protect the new people to kittycats that don't know the controversy behind the RMs?
It may protect others from being robbed and insulted. And not everyone trolls forums
and would have no clue about what may happen to them.

[Minx Diabolito]

Hiya Dev =)

He cannot use the pictures anymore so they shouldn't be on the profilers.

However on all of his listings inworld and the marketplace listing he uses the pictures he has been told not to use as it is copyright theft to sell the product. https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/RMs-KittyCatS-Profiler-Owner/6197874

He is using copywritten images from kittycats to sell his product still and mislead people that this is what they are buying. They are not. It also says on his advertisement 'displays the picture of your kittycat'. No it does not, that is a lie. It is also beyond me how his product for the owner version has 5.67 stars? Impossible.

Same story for the Owner version of them. https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/RMs-KittyCatS-Profiler-Group/6197888

[Emilia Darkwatch]

5.67 stars? Haha. Incredible that anyone can get 5.67 out of 5 stars lol

It is false advertising to show the profilers with cat pics on, they have not showed those for ages and he understands very well he has no right to use those. As per usual, he will have to be forced to remove them as he does not have the decency to do it by himself or honesty to his customers to even care they are not getting what is shown. Imagine if you were someone new and you thought "oh great I have a nice thing to showcase the pic of my cat", pay for them and then get nothing but a blank profiler for your money

[Devilness Chant]

Hi Minx!

I haven't been in world in ages to see what is what. I did look the profilers up on MP, and he should be made to change those pictures he has there. After all they are copyrighted kitty pictures....hint hint Those are misleading and omg I bet after spending all those lindens on his product and ending up with something less would be a major disappointment. Not to mention, the abusive treatment after the fact.

It's a shame that he can freely take peoples money, then shaft them. But if anyone tries to put up warnings or give bad reviews it's against tos and so forth.

I would recommend putting up ads on all the kitty sims promoting Tormonds (sorry if I got the spelling wrong) profilers. Maybe it will steer new people from buying the other one.

[Minx Diabolito]

Torgon's, Dev =P

[Arwen Swordthain]

(01-27-2018 07:15 PM)Emilia Darkwatch Wrote:  5.67 stars? Haha. Incredible that anyone can get 5.67 out of 5 stars lol

It is false advertising to show the profilers with cat pics on, they have not showed those for ages and he understands very well he has no right to use those. As per usual, he will have to be forced to remove them as he does not have the decency to do it by himself or honesty to his customers to even care they are not getting what is shown. Imagine if you were someone new and you thought "oh great I have a nice thing to showcase the pic of my cat", pay for them and then get nothing but a blank profiler for your money

I daresay if enough of us file a report stating he is using images that are copyrighted and he does not have permission to use them, along with the fact that he is misrepresenting his product by his continued use of them to advertise his listing that Ll will act to remove the images if not the listing.

I have just flagged it as item not as advertised and incorrect listing image on both listings, if other so this as well maybe we can at least get it changed so new breeders don't buy thinking they will see an image of their cat on the profiler. Seems only Callie can flag it for infringing her intellectual proprty though.