Teacup breeding

[AnnaEVida Resident]

New to KittyCats and have been trying to breed my teacups but they always seem to have 'normal' sized kittens . Will this always happen?

Thanks in advance
Anna

[HikariItsumo Resident]

Hi Anna,

Size is totally random & you might as well never get "special" sizes from your pair of teacups.

Hikari

[Kayla Woodrunner]

An unusual size (teacup, toy, petite, bigger de big, mega) happens about 1 in 7 cats. Not 1 in 7 cats of just your cats. But 1 in 7 cats birthed in the Kittycats universe. I've noticed, I have better luck getting a special size, when I try to get my kitties to have kittens on the same day as close to the same time as possible. Maybe it increases the odds that my pairs are in the same 1 in 7 grouping. Tad or some of the other people who monitor stats more than me might know if it is true or coincidence.

[Tad Carlucci]

In theory, it should not matter.

But, in practice, I would suggest that you'll have better luck at times when you're getting more of the boxes than 'normal' ('average' ???). Stacking your box production to all appear close together might get you more boxes than others, for that time period. Or shifting your box production to a low-traffic time of day might help.

But, again, in theory, it should not matter. So it may work, or it may not. And, when we examine the 'kitty universe' any effect you see should disappear in the statistical 'noise' which is randomness.

[Kayla Woodrunner]

I'm so happy. I need to post more about odd sizes in the forum. My babies birthed a mega today (and not clumped together). So my new magic thinking is to post in the forum comments about special sizes and then maybe I will get it, Coincidentally, mom was a mega too. This is what I just got:

? New Born Kitten
Fur: Bengal - Black
Eyes: Blacklight (Curious|Big)
Shade: Twinkle
Tail: Fussy
Ears: Odyssey No. 1
Whiskers: Black (Frazzled)
Size: MegaPuss

[Vrem Vaniva]

Awesome mega, Kayla! Congrats! Bengal blacks with interesting black whiskers are so impressive! I also love it when they have interesting tails.

I am intrigued by Tad's suggestion about "shifting your box production to a low traffic time of the day." I did get one LE mega by superstitiously taking my unidentified box purchase to a favorite sandbox at 3 a. m. to rez it out. Low traffic sandbox, low traffic time. Who knows? Randomness just happens. Still ...

Yes theoretically size is random. But there are also some kitties with a lot of "special sizes" in their family trees. Coincidence or formula, who knows? Randomness can be calculated in many many different ways. The only answer we ever get, when asking about sizes, is that "it's random". But what kind of random it is, exactly, we don't know.

Even regular kitty breedings have enormous amounts of randomness in the selection of their traits. Generally with the regular 9 traits we know it's a " coin toss" for each parent, with each parent contributing one of its two "genes" for each given trait. On Size, we really don't know what type of randomness is used, except for the statistics already gathered about how many to expecct , of each size, per one hundred kittens. Even those numbers would benefit from larger sample sizes.

And we still don't know if kitties carry a size-likeliness gene somehow ... that would not be ruled out by the "it's random" statement.

[Tad Carlucci]

The idea behind attempting to cluster your box production and trying for a period where production is low is that, while your base odds are always the same, you're attempting to get a few more boxes (per unit time) than the average player .. at that time. In the long run, it certainly makes no difference. But, hey, it's something to do.
--

Some kitties APPEAR to have a lot of non-Normal sizes only due to player psychology. First, the odds (around 1-in-7) are fairly high, so we should expect quite a few such groupings. Second, people naturally, and falsely, assume more importance to longer runs of 'similar' results. Also, searching for examples usually includes ignoring all results showing the contrary. And finally, discussion of such groupings creates the false impression they're more important simply because nobody is posting all those other groupings while fail to support the claims. All things considered, it's not coincidence .. there is nothing going on other than people doing what people naturally do when presented with randomness.

Saying, 'generally' implies there are times when it's not true. ALWAYS, with each of the 9 traits, for each parent, FAIR coins (18 in all) select which values to pass.

There are no 'types' to randomness; there is only randomness. That said, yes, larger sample sizes will produce more precise estimates of the odds; but the samples used seem good enough for normal use by a typical player.

There are simple tests designed specifically for cases like this, which can show if information is present for Size. If the data is randomly selected, to avoid experimental bias, the results indicate there is none; so I am satisfied there is no undiscovered genetic marker to look for. To me, that simply confirms the statement from KittyCatS that Size is random.

[Kayla Woodrunner]

I know randomness means that sometimes within randomness, you can get coincidences which means a particular pair may get more than it's share of special size babies. So I do understand that intellectually, Tad.

However, I do agree with Vrem, on a gut level, it does seem like once in a blue moon, I get a special pair who pop out the specials. Now I like to crossbreed a lot so for the most part, my cats don't often get the same partner again and again. I made one exception because they would pop out specials Abby + Tannen. Here was the line up.

Child 1. Normal (Parents: Lucia + Tannen xmas starter). This child is named Bridgette, Tannen's daughter
Child 2. Toy (Parents: Abby + Tannen) This child is named Morella.
Child 3. Toy (Parents: Abby + Tannen)
Child 4. Normal (Parents: Abby + Meeko)
Child 5. Normal (Parents: Bridgette + Tannen)
Child 6. Normal (Parents: Abby + Ferrell)
Child 7. Normal (Parents: Bridgette + Tannen)
Child 8. Teacup (Parents: Abby + Tannen)
Child 9. Normal (Parents: Abby + Tannen)
Child 10. Normal (Parents: Morella + Tannen)
Child 11. Normal (Parents: Abby + Patches)
Child 12. Normal (Parents: Abby + Bede)
Child 13. Mega (Parents: Numina + Tannen)
Child 14. Normal (Parents: Pia + Tannen)

Abby and Tannen had 5 children together. 2 toys, 1 teacup and 2 normal
All other Abby children are norms
Tannen had 1 mega with another and the rest were norms.

If about 1 in 7 are special, you would expect most cats to have 1 to 2 children who are special if you breed the full cycle of 120 days getting about 10-15 children. So these two together were incredibly high. I was sad, though, that Tannen was a starter as he liked to pass genesis traits along with special sizes. The one child I did birth only had 1 special. I didn't birth 2 of the specials as genesis fur. Tannen's mega child I sold so don't know about its children. I bought Abby and Tannen from a love table so they probably had children before I got them but again I have no way of knowing if they were special sizes.

I really wish I could have more kittycats that would have 4 special chidren! Sadly, it never happened again.

[Tad Carlucci]

"On a gut level" is my point. It realizes that people want to see meaning where none is present.

If it's random, we have to expect that we can examples such as above. In fact, if we could not find them, it would strongly indicate Size was not really random.

[Kayleigh McMillan]

(12-23-2014 03:37 PM)Tad Carlucci Wrote:  "On a gut level" is my point. It realizes that people want to see meaning where none is present.

If it's random, we have to expect that we can examples such as above. In fact, if we could not find them, it would strongly indicate Size was not really random.

God seems to act and believed in randomly too it has a lot of meaning for some though..