Menagerie & Supply & Demand

[Lixy Byron]

(05-29-2015 05:54 PM)Devilness Chant Wrote:  I would also love maybe a one time shot to get permapets with K$.

oh but you already can!
actually, with K$, you can buy food, milk, vitamins, collars, hats, vests, the hud, the autofeeder, the creator kits, the scratch-n-play, the laudry basket, and of course also the Perma!

would be cool have something special that can't be buy with money but only with the menagerie cats/boxes, so a new/special item would be really appreciate right now

[Nocshadue Balbozar]

I think the KC team has a database of every cat ever rezzed with it's UUID. The info will show who owns the cat, the age, traits etc well you get the drift. It wouldn't be hard to write a query to give some averages. They do not have to be registered on this site or in the SL group to be included. There would be no way to know whether or not a particular breeder is actually making boxes, but it could be known what the possible boxes are they could get. That would be a decent starting off point I think.

No matter what (if anything) is ever done of this ilk, it will never encompass EVERY breeder, this is about averages and what is happening with the majority.

I remember when the menagerie tigers first came out there was a huge outcry from smaller breeders saying how unfair it was to them and that they would never have a chance to get a tiger. I don't remember the numbers, but I seem to recall somewhere around 300 boxes being needed? I remember the KC team saying it was meant to be something that people looked forward to and "saved up" for, it was supposed to be a little hard to get to make it special. I had already been breeding and hoarding boxes for a while so I was able to get one. It did hide the tiger curl tail that at the time was challenging for me to breed out but eventually did. It was fun, but you know, I've never, ever gotten one of the "Fancie Cats" from jewels, but I have had every one of the fancie eyes because I just wait for the price to come down a bit and buy me some. So I wonder at times what it is that people really want, and I think what they want is the chance to be the first to get that new Menagerie trait which is understandable. So maybe even just a new random, just because, starter cat, and yeah, maybe just CAT and not COLLECTION so there's no pressure to "get them all"?

And if they just want a tiger because they think they are cute etc? I am sure a wanted post here could get you one, probably fairly reasonable if you just wanted a pet and would take one past breeding age. Same with the menagerie traits.. the tail, ears, and eyes are all fairly easy to find and reasonably priced. But I really think the high we're chasing is in finding something new.

I've been trying to think of something we could do to get some boxes out of circulation but not cause any complaints and I'll be damned if I can think of anything.

If they make new Menagerie Cats, someone will say they've devalued them by making them easier to get etc or whatever.

If they increase the K$ per menagerie cat/box, I can hear people possibly say "well why should I rent a shop to sell cats for 50L when I can menagerie them." I imagine that would take a while to happen, but people in general tend to be impatient and if sales don't improve right away, I can see shops closing and maybe some sim owners a bit unhappy.

If they do release a new menagerie cat, people will complain when the market is inevitably flooded with them for a time after their release as some look to cash in on their box hoard.

After a lot of thinking honestly, because I do care about our community quite a bit, I gave this a lot of thought. It's still jumbled I admit, but my conclusion so far is this. I think it would be good for us overall to increase the K$ per menagerie box/cat or at least reduce the amount needed for a normal size menagerie cat. It IS an awful lot of cats to send off just to get ONE, that may or MAY NOT even hide a menagerie trait! I think.... they should release several new traits at a time in the tiger or whatever, but have at least one new trait guaranteed to be there. I hesitated to suggest that because with things like the fruit eyes, they got old pretty fast in the market because everyone had them, but not EVERYONE will have these menagerie cats, at least not all at once like a holiday collection. To be honest I'd like to see them increase the amount of K$ you get across the board to encourage more sending off to help buy kibble, though I know that is unlikely to happen as it will eat into the bottom line of KC. But... now is the time to look at not only the bottom line and profit margin today...but down the road as well. There is an ebb and flow to all things and I would really like to see KC keep going and be strong enough, with enough LOYAL breeders to continue for years to come. Accepting a small loss today could do wonders to prevent larger losses down the road in any situation. I just want to leave you with this thought on menagerie. I've been sending off most of my cats that have aged out since I spend K on a disco tiger. I still don't have enough for another tiger and just barely have enough for a 20 pack of just kibble. I'm not a small breeder. I save my costume cats and just a very few that are special and I intend to permapet. That's a loooooooong time to save up for one cat. Now I don't usually menagerie boxes, even "duds", because they don't cost me anything to keep. If I did, I could have a dozen or more tigers, but I don't. I did menagerie some when the tigers first came out and I regretted it, so now I keep em. That's on me, and it's ok. I also don't care if I ever sell any, that's just me too. However, if it were feasible to really make a dent in a kibble bill with K$, I would be sorting through some boxes. And I'm a die hard hoarder.

Anyway... I'll stop rambling now and go pair some cats.

[Lostime Resident]

They can't lower the amount or increase the amount of k$ for a menagerie box, the same with the amount of box's for a menagerie tiger.
It would give a lot of complaints "My tigers cost a lot more this is not fair" or "I menagerie 50 box yesterday this is not fair I could have gotten more k$".

All that will work is more tigers or products that can only be bought with menagerie k$. I would love a kittycats avatar!

We need to find away where people would want to menagerie box's!

Or something like "donating some to RFL" could work as well.

[Devilness Chant]

(05-30-2015 08:16 AM)Lixy Byron Wrote:  

(05-29-2015 05:54 PM)Devilness Chant Wrote:  I would also love maybe a one time shot to get permapets with K$.

oh but you already can!
actually, with K$, you can buy food, milk, vitamins, collars, hats, vests, the hud, the autofeeder, the creator kits, the scratch-n-play, the laudry basket, and of course also the Perma!

would be cool have something special that can't be buy with money but only with the menagerie cats/boxes, so a new/special item would be really appreciate right now

I meant a one time shot at less managery kitties to get the permapet. My fault I should have clarified. lol

[JC Aferdita]

The problem isn't there not being anything to purchase with the k$, the problem is that there are a lot of people shaming people for sending boxes and cats to the Menagerie, saying they are killing the cat and that they are murderers. It makes new breeders think that it's something wrong. I know a lot of the Support Staff is trying to quiet those people down and explain what the menagerie actually is, but they aren't around 24Seven either. If we could stop the mentality of people being murderers for sending a box or cat to the menagerie I think that would influence more than just hanging up carrots for people to try and catch.

[Bumblebliss Resident]

Murderers sending kitties off to the menagerie???? Oh LOL LOL LOL!!!! Not even going to comment on the mentality of that! Sorry, I am besides myself in a fit of laughter! Don't get me wrong, I will permanent a favorite cat that it took me so long to finally achieve, but the lines I do not sell I menagerie everything that does not fill a need.

[JC Aferdita]

Yeah, that's how it is supposed to be, but I see all of the time in group chat people shaming other people for even mentioning Menagerie and sending private IMs telling them they are murderers. It's a real problem.

[Ivy Norsk]

Yes, JC, I've seen those people in chat too, though nobody has ever sent me a personal IM. I don't think there's much to be done about them other than reinforcing an idea of Routine Menagerieing of cats. It's the natural flip side of the kitties being so endearing.
I still think that having more incentives out there to menagerie would help counteract those people. The tigers do seem out of reach for smaller breeders, and not worth the bother.

[SweetSinz Resident]

Great thread, great ideas.

This would make more incentive not to stockpile boxes, which is an awesome thing to be able to do, but not at all realistic compared to breeding physical kittycats in RL. It would encourage the active breeding of cats for beauty or combination of traits rather than new traits constantly, and increase the value of retired traits, as was pointed out above.

I also love the megapuss or teacup vitamin or other off the wall ideas for menagarie dollars.

Most new collectibles are 790L, and menagarie dollars 50K=30L for each kitten so 16-27 menagarie boxes could qualify you for the new collectible without changing the value of anything. Even 30 boxes would probably be acceptable to those who keep fewer breeding cats.

Even a costume cat, like the st. paddy's, next cat born after you menagarie the required amount in your "saver" box.

Loving the ideas!! Thank you everybody.

[Shamu077 Resident]

I have never seen any of the KittyCats owners ever express any concern about the oversupply of KittyCats (live or boxes). As long as they continue to sell their SE cats for $790 with new Lindens during the Fall to Spring selling season, and attract enough new people to KC to keep buying starters, kibble, milk, and accessories with new Lindens, their business model is intact.

However, the menagerie represents nothing but a loss to the owners. Even though you get $20L per cat, that can only be used to by more KC items, it still represents lost sales of new Lindens to them. If they wanted to increase their profits, they would cut the credit to $10L per cat, not increase it as everyone proposes here.

As far as using $K to buy the SE cats, well that isn't going to happen. That $790 per SE is in new Lindens, and they are not going to lose those sales to $K, which represent nothing to them. BTW the actual SE cat costs about $600 after you subtract the food and vitamins in each package. So at $20L per menagerie cat, that is 30 cats for a SE cat. They are still not going to lose those sales to the worthless (to KC) $K.

Now if you could convince the owners that increasing the incentives to menagerie cats will save their business from eventual failure, they might consider something. But why has there been no new menagerie special cats, or new traits for the last three years? Because, I think, there has been no reason for them to do so.

Large breeders are dropping out or cutting back more this year than ever, and that means less food and milk sales to KC. Until KC is concerned that losing the large breeders will affect their bottom line, I would not look for menagerie incentives.

Will the small breeders menagerie their cats for food and special cats if they can get a mega tiger for say 100 cats, not the 350 needed now? Well maybe, once they get 100 cats they cant give away. But then the value of all tigers will decrease dramatically. More supply and less "cost" to buy in $K, means $L1000 tigers, not the present $L8000 average asking price. So there will be more Pet tigers out there, meaning more Permapet sales. Is that enough incentive to the KC owners? New and cheaper menagerie cats with new traits would not cost them lost sales. So why have there been none for the last three years?