Starters Gen. kittens useless?

[LizzehWolfe Resident]

I have several starters right now that I'm using as projects to learn about traits and having fun figuring out what traits they're hiding... My question is, can I back breed or sibling breed all of their Genesis kittens to help figure out their hiddens, or are all these kittens useless? Or, would they be hiding the other parents fur? If so, would I be able to breed them in hopes of getting this fur? (Of course, I know the easiest way to get said fur is to breed that parent, but am asking to help learn how traits work ^^) I would hate to breed these kittens, only to end up with MORE Genesis furs .

My other question regarding all of this, is what about the non-Genesis kittens I've gotten from these starters that have the other parents fur...same question, would they be hiding these starters hiddens? So confuzed regarding this area of it....for now I am using recessive furs with them (and hoping for the best), and leaving the Genesis kittens in the cattery until I hear whether they are worth using or not (unless of course they have certain traits I'd like to play with pulling instead of buying).

Any help, tips would be greatly appreciated, ty in advance

[Barbara Collazo]

If you bred a genesis cat to a non genesis cat and got the genesis traits, then they are hiding the other parent's traits. The kittens aren't useless--they have the other parent's non-gen traits, but you won't get the starter cat's hiddens out of them.

If they have the other parent's trait showing then yes, they are hiding the starter's hidden trait--and you also know that trait is recessive to the other parent's--fur, in the case you asked about. This is where sib breeding or back breeding can be useful.

As someone who has a bunch of kitties about to turn 121, I also want to mention not to neglect the whiskers and minor traits...breed to find those hiddens too, not just furs.

Barbara

[Hathor Xaris]

Theres no such thing as a dud kitty, only a breeder without patience, all kitties have the potential to hide GREAT things especially any new genesis furs / starters, but the nicer things take more patience, after back breeding 2-3 times into parent or sibling you may find genesis furs won't pop out as much, helps to use your most recessive furs like a foxie salt & pepper 9T with starters then take baby of appropriate gender and breed with starter parent again, just remember if you do pull a dominant fur in the ped with anything showing that comes out recessive like foxie s&p then this cat will no longer hide these dominant things in the pedigree, in other words only recessive things in the pedigree to the shown fur/trait of the cat can be considered a passable hidden trait.

[LizzehWolfe Resident]

Ok, TY! I sat and figured it out so now I'm closer to understanding...fur-wise, the Genesis kittens would hide the other parents fur, and the non-Genesis are the ones who have a chance of hiding the starter parents fur...so either way, I shouldn't toss them if I feel like working to bring either out from these kittens, same for the other traits. Yay...feel free to delete this post, I've relabeled them all in my cattery ^^.

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(04-14-2014 11:14 AM)Hathor Xaris Wrote:  Theres no such thing as a dud kitty, only a breeder without patience, all kitties have the potential to hide GREAT things especially any new genesis furs / starters, but the nicer things take more patience, after back breeding 2-3 times into parent or sibling you may find genesis furs won't pop out as much, helps to use your most recessive furs like a foxie salt & pepper 9T with starters then take baby of appropriate gender and breed with starter parent again, just remember if you do pull a dominant fur in the ped with anything showing that comes out recessive like foxie s&p then this cat will no longer hide these dominant things in the pedigree, in other words only recessive things in the pedigree to the shown fur/trait of the cat can be considered a passable hidden trait.

Wow, this helps too, ty Hathor! This is so fun for me, and I don't mind the work at all! Also a huge TY for your kitties in helping me in this journey...I've visited your live cattery, stores and MP many times already ;D.

[Hathor Xaris]

I think that it always helps to leave a post like this for all newcomers we all love to learn from each other, which is why I'd also like to add these 2 links for any newcomers who may not have yet seen them , The first is the list of dominance charts for all kittycats traits and 2nds is link to list of when all the traits have been discovered, I don't go a day without looking at the dominance charts , after awhile you do memorize it. Happy Breedingto all!

Dominance charts
http://kittycats.biz/forum/showthread.php?tid=2351

When traits were discovered
http://kittycats.biz/forum/showthread.php?tid=5706