I ran into a surprise and would like to know whether a more experienced breeder could have predicted this. (I have only been breeding for a little over a month.)
I bred an Aby Dark mom with grape ice eyes, with both parents and three out of four grandparents also Aby Dark (the fourth grandparent was an Australian Mist Blue Marble), to a Chateau Cat Pink & White whose parents were both pink-and-whites. I was expecting a pink-and-white with the mom's grape ice eyes.
Instead, I ended up with a Foxie Salt & Pepper.
Screen shots are attached.
Is this something I should have known would happen?
The dad hides the Foxie - Salt & Pepper fur. Only way you could know this is if 1) you could see this in your pedigree for Paddington Paws, 2) had previously bred another fur that was recessive to the Foxie - Salt & Pepper to Paddington Paws and gotten that fur, c) been told by the breeders of the parents or grandparents that the Foxie - Salt & Pepper could be hiding on Paddington Paws.
Additional note: the new kitten could hide either Abyssinian - Dark Chocolate or Australian Mist - Blue Marble.
I was able to get Paddington Paws back one more generation, but there was no Foxie there either, only pink & whites and one Bali Cream. So it must go WAY back.
So yes, Paddington Paws Grandma, Diana, is the one that hides that fur. That isn't really that far back yet but could go way back depending on Diana's background.
So you can tell from these pedigrees that it's the Bali (Diana) who is hiding it? I'm sorry if that sounds like a dumb question, but I'm still trying to learn.
(10-10-2015 08:54 PM)Aisling MacMoragh Wrote: [ -> ]So yes, Paddington Paws Grandma, Diana, is the one that hides that fur. That isn't really that far back yet but could go way back depending on Diana's background.
she is the most likely suspect since she actually shows a more recessive fur than the pink and white. though technically it could have come from any of them. but would bet she is the source. good question. and even if it wasn't you should still ask if you don't know. best way to learn and we all start somewhere.
It can happen: a recessive fur can pass for generations -- if you breed 2 domnant furs together, like pinky to pinky, you won't know the recessive passed until you breed it to soemthing more recessive like you did with the aby dark. Foxie Salt&Pepper ws the most recessive for awhile so it's the hid on a surprising number of kitties. The previous breeder may not have known it was there if the most recessive they bred to that line was the bali cream.
I appreciate your help, Aisling and Kayla. I thought I could be reasonably sure what I was going to get out of that breeding - it's good to know that not only the newest breeders make that mistake.
It's not a mistake. It's good to pop your kitties against something very recessive at least a couple times in their breeding cycle to find out if you have any hids. Could be something you really want that you don't know you had. Honestly it's how I got Scotty Fold ears and Fluffy tail the first time when I bought the kitties second hand for 100L. The owners didn't know what they had and didn't test against very recessive. Testing is always good.
So what did you get? You got a Foxie SP, a very recessive fur, usually pretty useful to breed against Halloween kitties and other starters since they have been on the market long enough that they usually have other recessive traits on them. There are only 6 furs more recessive than Foxie out of 90 furs so it works well to pop hiddens if you don't want to use an Aby Dark Choco or Blue Marble (whether because you don't have enough or you're chasing something elusive on another cat). Not as useful to sell since it used to be the most recessive, now a lot of people already have them but a solid breed to pop furs.
The Foxie hides Dark Aby or more recessive (lost Pinkie). The Grape Eyes hides Fancie Green or more recessive; the Plush tail hides Chop Chop or Stubby or more recessive than Stubby; The Ody #1 hides Ody #1 or MOF or more recessive than MOF (lost curious), the B&W hides blonde or more recessive (lost silver); Mysterious is hte only real problem as you may have double Mysterious. That Pinky hides Dreamy or more recessive, be cool to get that dreamy out. With the other traits being fairly dom though, probably wouldn't use this as a breeder.
Too bad it's not a girl, you could use it to pop out that blonde whisker by pairing back to the Pinky.
My personal opinion is no cat is a mistake and there are different reasons to breed cats together including finding out their hids which you did here. You didn't make a mistake: you found out more about the traits each kitty had.
Thank you very much. This is very helpful!