KittyCatS! Community Forum

Constantly people bicker about the amounts they spend on pretend cats! Does anybody put a gun to your head and say BREED KITTIES NOW!! YOU NEED TO HAVE KITTIES! YOU NEED TO BREEED KITTIES!!!
I don’t think they do. Hahahahahahahahaha if you have land issues there YOUR land issues and if you feel like you need to charge people 10k for doing something you like to do then fine charge 10k shoot I say charge a millionk if you want you think its worth it. But don’t get mad because someone else believes that same cat or one similar should go for 10l it’s their opinion. Just as much as 10k was yours. Period. The main market is the food, cats, accessories, etc. Period. In other words ….what the main kc production crew makes. What we do with their product is our prerogative and should not be judged. It’s secondary. Please let’s stop acting like it’s an original product because it’s not. All the cats you make THEY MADE. All you did was give 38l a week per cat to show off their work. If you don’t have the 38l per cat per week then don’t breed don’t put yourself and us through it. If you do then more power to ya. Stop moaning.
Every game there is competition I understand this. So wait as I am typing I am realizing it’s not the product that is what we are competing over. It’s the price of the cat o.O. it’s no longer who puts out a pretty product. For the love of the product it’s about who made the most off of somebody else’s back. And how loudly we can proclaim oooooooooooooooooooooo I got the product you gave me and made a killing instead of showcasing them for all. That’s what we do when we fight in the forum over pricing. We are saying hey I bought your cat for 200L (or how ever a single cat cost in the shop …see I rarely buy from there I can’t even tell you how much a cat cost. O.O) and I decided hey they should pay my bills on my land. (This is me I am not left out of the equation: P) I NEED NEW HAIR so let’s sell a cat. Is this really what we are doing? Are we truly those kinds of people? Or do I really not understand what’s going on. I am going through this long winded diatribe to figure out really why do we fighting over pretend cats?

I think it's because they feel hurt because their expectations for what the hobby was and what they could get out of it were not met. (This is a general "they" - I'm not talking about a specific "they".)
The expectations were probably not realistic, and also the market has changed over the lifespan of KittyCats!.
Some expectations were Group-created (you can sell your extra cats - look at all the markets), some SL-created (let's all have an SL Business!), not all were self-generated.

Hey Sam! I am also disappointed with the bickering... and I agree with Ivy.

Samai, you're always so spot on LOL I don't know, it feels like people may be too emotionally-invested/dependent on the secondary market of the game and their expectations of said market. The market fluctuates; we're in 2014 now and a lot of reflections point to markets that existed in 2011! Things have changed since, and will continue to change.

Everyone who is becoming so emotionally-invested should take a step back and realize that we're all in this together as a community. That doesn't mean we're all going to agree on every little aspect of the secondary market which is ours, but this is a hobby that we all share and should embrace. Each one of us has something in common: KittyCatS, not to mention other possible interests. The friendships that we have woven through KittyCatS give incentive to continue in the hobby and partake in the secondary market. Ultimately, you may miss out on a few friendships through hurting someone's feelings due to comments of disdain that may apply to them. By burning bridges through indirectly putting down the way a person may operate in the secondary market really isn't helpful for our community as a whole. The community = our secondary market, and without it the secondary market is nothing.

There is no 'right' or 'wrong' way to play the secondary market. Spoiler: Neither a group majority's definition of 'good pricing' is correct nor is any esteemed note card passed around for pricing. (Not to mention the current note card I've seen was made in 2012 - we're quite a ways away from the market in 2012!) And while everyone is entitled to their opinions, it should be remembered that opinions posted for everyone to read may make someone feel hurt and unmotivated to participate in KittyCatS as a whole, especially the secondary market.

And just like Samaii said, our emotions are going into arguing over a market for pretend cats, for goodness sake! As much as I love KittyCatS, the cherished friends I've made in this community, my personal breeding project kitties, my toy/teacup/petite collectors over the years, and that which I've learned about the different breeds introduced in-game - I even adopted a Balinese Seal Lynx RL named Kamila due to my love for them in KC, I think that we should consider not letting our passion for this hobby be at the expense of others.

i have wanted to chime in on a post like this for uh... years?

so here goes...

many people "do" KittyCatS, or anything in life for many reasons. we have NO idea what those are. (i think we rarely know our own selves and our motives, so how can we know another's?)

and here is my "theory".

1. some do it for pure pleasure, like shopping or dancing, or shopping, or shopping or building houses or whatever they do that they do NOT expect to pay them with money. (payment can come in many ways, not just money)
2. some do it for a challenge, like achieving personal goals, one could be making their own perfect cat. this can also be #1, but with the frustration, probably not pure pleasure.
3. some do it for a light hobby. more a "whatever" attitude, having fun yet not totally pleasure or challenge.
4. some have one cat for a pet, period. end of story and enjoy that, are part of the community and have fun.
5. some want a business and approach it as such, working 8 or more hours a day like one would for any business they want to succeed.
6. some want a business and expect things to sell w/o working at it.
7. some come in hearing "omg you can make tons of money doing nothing!!!"
8. a number of other reasons...
9. infinite other reasons

one thing that has happened in "breedables" is the expectation that they SHOULD pay for themselves. i think because of the ability to potentially earn money from them.

when i started with the first "breedable" in sl, there wasn't a whole lot of selling going on. it was mostly giving, trading, and crying when they died (they would die if they went off world or a number of ways NEVER to be brought to life again)

but it was FUN. somewhere someone "sold' their first chicken, and slowly a "market" was born... and we would sell or not, and it wasn't a big deal. was just a little "bonus" for the fun we were having.

as time went on, the "selling" brought in many more people who want to make money and to many of us doing it just for "fun" it wasn't a big deal at all. and as that demographic grew, so did the feeling of things. there was now tons of people coming to make money... and somewhere in there a mindset was born as well as "this SHOULD pay for itself".

i never felt that way. i did it because i truly LOVED the surprises, my own projects, the creativity i could express (started making housing for chickens that was cute) and i did it "my way", others did it "their way" and most of us have had a whole lot of fun.

i supposed i never thought back then they should pay for themselves any more than i thought my hair or skins or clothes that i bought should pay for themselves. it was just part of what i did in sl.

anyway, back to KittyCatS, and this community! this is exciting to be part of an evolving community and yes, things do change and i really love the community and creative aspect the most in being part of this with all of you.

we will always have disagreements, and view things differently. that's life, in SL or not. and i think one thing we share is we do like cats and we do also as humans like to have fun, share our lives with others, and feel loved and appreciated, and connected.

this community allows that for many and for that i am beyond thankful.

so, yeah, if you can, try not to judge others... it's HARD... and keep doing what you do with your little projects, classes, contest, and other creative things... it's VERY inspiring to so many... i hear stories ALL THE TIME about how much fun a class was or an auction or a hunt, dance, visiting a cattery, how a new person was helped, how someone gave someone a cat, and more. i think maybe we have no idea how much people are touched by what we all DO, together and separately.

and i promise you, i hear it all the time! so for any "negative" things, there are tons of positive things outweighing them all the time. and with the "negative" or what we call that, we can always learn, grow and understand things differently, and that is priceless too.

ok done!!!

I so agree!
We breed each for our own goals and we can't make others to have our goal or price range that would be just odd.

Edit

A hobby budget and stick to that can do miracles to destress for those who think kitties should always pay for themselves.
If they do cool and all but it is indeed a lot of work to create a business out of it.
Not to say that isn't possible though.
But those in it for fun and wanting to earn some fun money can't be dictated to ask the same amount of money for a similar cat as business X feels is sound.

P.S.

I had a renter who bred Sion chickens, God grief >.<
I will not tell you the end of this story cos it may sound cruel to chickenlovers xD
An other reason to breed cats only!

Have you seen the recommended pricing guide made by Kittycats? Its a document. Here's the link: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1QyfYs6dNKx9EkFZcsmhL-VFrLPGA96bq3V0bD1IxOb8/edit?pli=1

Thoughts?

(06-19-2014 10:35 PM)Beryl Landar Wrote: [ -> ]Have you seen the recommended pricing guide made by Kittycats? Its a document. Here's the link: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1QyfYs6dNKx9EkFZcsmhL-VFrLPGA96bq3V0bD1IxOb8/edit?pli=1

Thoughts?

This price document is not made by KittyCats they do not interfear or take position as for prices and especially not as for the secondary market goes.
I think this is an initiative from one or more breeders which is adopted by some.

It is an initiative from the KittyCats Price Check Group:
secondlife:///app/group/3a133ff2-defd-03c5-14f3-c26e2a9c2549/about
You can see this at the very buttom of this document.
Ran by breeders for breeders people can ask questions in this group on how they should price their kitties and what the opinion of others are.

It links to this Forum thread »

(06-19-2014 10:35 PM)Beryl Landar Wrote: [ -> ]Have you seen the recommended pricing guide made by Kittycats? Its a document. Here's the link: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1QyfYs6dNKx9EkFZcsmhL-VFrLPGA96bq3V0bD1IxOb8/edit?pli=1

Thoughts?

I'd like to underline Kay's comment about this by saying that this is an arbitrary pricing list,,there is nothing in any way official about it, and should be taken only as a very general idea for anyone just starting to sell.
To be fair, the author has also taken time to explain this carefully but the problem is that many only read then copy paste the prices and don't bother to read the rest of the info on pricing, and this is why i'm against any kind of pricing list circulating in the community.
This list is also rather old and i now see people fling out 50L$ or less per trait when the subject comes up in group chat.
Anyhow, as we know at 1 traited kitty can sell for anything from 50L$ to 50,000 L$ or more in the case of a brand new ultra recessive.

Anyhow back to the OP before i start fighting

I think the answer is that the world is walking on it's head.
One only has to look at the hysterical crowd in front of the Apple mainstore on the release of a new app to know this. They'll rip each other apart to be the first to own it, and for what ? a gadget just to phone with and do some of the stuff they can already do much more comfortably on their computer anyhow.

Also i could never understand how some people could spend most of their waking hours in front of their PC, then gradually i found myself doing more or less the same some days, especially when i first discovered SL and then Kittycats.
A few years back if i'd known that anyone was spending 120 USD/month for pixel land and up to the same to breed pixel cats i'd have seriously urged them to go consult before they got taken away in a straight jacket.

There is also an extremely pernicious effect :
The brain naturally functions on vastly complex algorithms based on the Golden Number, as does all living matter (see : plant structures, the sunflower for example)
The constant exposure to binary and decimal functioning information gradually modifies and impoverishes our brain patterns also, and as we (should) know all parts of our body and psychism are indisociable so this can results in our emotional reactions becoming disordered, hence our total overreaction concerning our pixel pets.
This is just one of the methods used to produce the programmed anarchic disorganization of the human being as a whole, in other words, virtualization.

I'm definitely not giving anyone a lesson here, far from it as i ACTUALLY KNEW ALL THIS before entering my phase of becoming totally hitched to my Mac.
For some reason i thought that as i knew the traps i was immune … DUH
I am now however breaking bad back to the real world and getting back to the real concrete stuff that i used to enjoy and rediscovering the real benefits and pleasures i used to have.
So it's never too late.

Personally I breed because its fun, I have no expectations to even cover the cost of my cat food by selling but I sell because thats fun too. As for price, well you can ask what you like but in the end as with anything in life its only worth what someone else is willing to pay. People that come into breeding thinking they are going to fund their SL are disillusioned, the only people truly making money are KittyCats themselves coz we all have to buy our food from them and with any breedable thats where he money is, the secondary market just fuels the need for those items only available from the mainstore. Its fun, its supposed to be fun, its not worth fighting over.